cp-e Full Control

[phailerider]

http://www.cp-e.com/imgs/FlashUpdateMZR23DISI.pdf

woah.... cpe speaks..lol its about time they actually talked about their product. Im excited about this. i think as time goes on we'll get a lot more specific information from them.

I need to call lou tomorrow... i'll get some more details. it looks like hes ready to talk a little!!!

Two great companys..... two nice options coming. looks like we all need to hold our horses. i wish theyd been more specific about pricing though. If their gonna compete with cobb they got their hands full, but I think they have the trust of the community enough that if the price is right and the tunes make power they'll be in the ballgame bigtime.

[Laloosh]

there is a god....
after losing hope with the recent flashes, hope remains

[phailerider]

aw...come on man... cobbs falshs are allright. it doesnt mean youre gonna want them over a similar flash+ standback for the same dough. I think thats where the competition is....

you read the damn file... lous already got the cobb flash..lol Cobb will have the cpe flash 24 hours after its released. hell Cobb will probably have it BEFORE its officially released.

its just a question of whether you want an AP, or a CPE flash + standback for roughly the same money.

[Laloosh]

Originally Posted by palerider aw...come on man... cobbs falshs are allright. it doesnt mean youre gonna want them over a similar flash+ standback for the same dough. I think thats where the competition is.... you read the damn file... lous already got the cobb flash..lol Cobb will have the cpe flash 24 hours after its released. hell theyll probably have it BEFORE its officially released. its just a question of whether you want an AP, or a CPE flash + standback for roughly the same money.

cobbs flash are starting to get better, however no1 knows how long before we are able to tune ourselves. Im not a fan of ots flashes and dont really feel comfy running some1 else tune. Just a personal thing. So for me, if hte cpe flash works out, ill go with the cpe/standback combo for sole reason that i can tune it myself on my local highway....in real life conditions, real life temps, loads ect ect

[Haltech]

That was a very well written article. I myself have looked through plenty of hex in my day and it was quite easy to determine what was code from data. Im looking forward to see what CP-e will be delivering.

[mrlilguy157]

hmmmmm.

[MS6 Alan]

Originally Posted by mrlilguy157 hmmmmm.

hahaha, i'm thinking the same...

[gsrtype1]

sweeet!

[javanc]

Good shits coming our way....I can feel it.
Nice write up CP-E.

[ev0nstispanka]

just when i thought that the market wasnt heading towards the speed3's way i was wrong. im glad. what benefits do you guys think we can get from this reflash?? def voiding warranty with this too right?

[Betelgeuse]

hmmm, these guys claim to know so much about this ECU and is obviously taking jabs at Cobb, yet:

1. They couldn't come out with a flash first.

2. They need to reverse engineer someone else's flash(s).


Sorry but I couldn't help but ponder the above after reading that article.

[phailerider]

Originally Posted by Betelgeuse hmmm, these guys claim to know so much about this ECU and is obviously taking jabs at Cobb, yet: 1. They couldn't come out with a flash first. 2. They need to reverse engineer someone else's flash(s). Sorry but I couldn't help but ponder the above after reading that article.

1. They feel like there are problems with the existing flashes. The results of said flashs would lead one to believe that they may be correct.

2. if you can download a flash and immediately form opinions on what was changed, identify the tables, and form opinions about the programming..... is it really reverse engineering? The thought that Lou needed these flashes to "understand" the ecu would be false.

Lou is working on throttle and temperature issues which are not addressed in the simpler flashes being offered right now.

[dadasracecar]

Lou cracked the flash from a CD of flashes for all Mazdas given to cp-e from a guy a dealership. He then figured out a more reliable way of reading and writing to the ecu than through the OBDII port. He can compare the stock flash to the COBB and Piasini flashes to see what they've done.

He started working on this when the piasini flash was discussed. cp-e has spent too much time in the Mazda market to get scooped by another company. He's more than a year behind COBB and Piasini in terms of the date when he started working on it. He's far ahead of both of them in understanding ALL of the parameters, tables, and logic of the ecu.

[Laloosh]

The mere fact that the cpe flash is not going to be a performance oriented flash should be enough proof that it wasnt jacked. Like said multiple times...their flash will address the temperature issues and throttle. Guess what cobb hasnt changed in any of their released flashes....temperature issues and throttle. So how can something that hasnt been released to the public be copied?

[NYpest]

Originally Posted by dadasracecar Lou cracked the flash from a CD of flashes for all Mazdas given to cp-e from a guy a dealership. He then figured out a more reliable way of reading and writing to the ecu than through the OBDII port. He can compare the stock flash to the COBB and Piasini flashes to see what they've done. He started working on this when the piasini flash was discussed. cp-e has spent too much time in the Mazda market to get scooped by another company. He's more than a year behind COBB and Piasini in terms of the date when he started working on it. He's far ahead of both of them in understanding ALL of the parameters, tables, and logic of the ecu.

Anyone can see ANY map changes with a simple FREE demo*(of course limited) download of WinOLS. I/anyone can import ANY tune maps into the software and see what maps and tables have been changed as long as i/anyone knows what to look for.

wanna see ?


ols2.jpg

By no means an easy task and if CPE brings there temp/tp solution to the community what a great addition as an option!

[dadasracecar]

Originally Posted by NYpest Anyone can see ANY map changes with a simple FREE demo*(of course limited) download of WinOLS. I/anyone can import ANY tune maps into the software and see what maps and tables have been changed as long as i/anyone knows what to look for. wanna see ? Attachment 619 By no means an easy task and if CPE brings there temp/tp solution to the community what a great addition as an option!

Yep, seeing differences is easy. THe hard part is actually knowing the size of the table, e.g. how many rows and columns, and what the axes of the table represent and what the data in the table represents.

[NYpest]

Originally Posted by dadasracecar Yep, seeing differences is easy. THe hard part is actually knowing the size of the table, e.g. how many rows and columns, and what the axes of the table represent and what the data in the table represents.

I agree

[Betelgeuse]

Originally Posted by dadasracecar He's far ahead of both of them in understanding ALL of the parameters, tables, and logic of the ecu.

And you know this how? Because he says so? I'll believe that when they actually have a product that performs. Until then it's just hot air.

[dadasracecar]

Originally Posted by Betelgeuse And you know this how? Because he says so? I'll believe that when they actually have a product that performs. Until then it's just hot air.

Because I sat next to him during part of the disassembly process and have seen the differences btw all of the maps.

[phailerider]

Originally Posted by Betelgeuse And you know this how? Because he says so? I'll believe that when they actually have a product that performs. Until then it's just hot air.

they could have a product that "performs" exactly as the AP flashs do right this minute. I was offered a flash on my car two weeks ago before it blew...lol

You people just dont get it do you.

They want to offere something different.... better. that includes programming parts of the ecu that we know have been problems for over a year now.... not just ignoring them and offering flashes when your shit doesnt run right.... or worse breaks... to make it better then.

[mdogg]

Originally Posted by Betelgeuse And you know this how? Because he says so? I'll believe that when they actually have a product that performs. Until then it's just hot air.

Please leave the vendor-nutswinging to m247 and m3f..... this is the forum for factual information and no bullshit. Thanks.

[Haltech]

Well, you will have fans in eaither direction. OPTIONS is a very good thing for us guys. Competition only brews the best end products for us!

People are always skeptical of the next best thing for our cars.

[Betelgeuse]

Originally Posted by palerider they could have a product that "performs" exactly as the AP flashs do right this minute. I was offered a flash on my car two weeks ago before it blew...lol You people just dont get it do you. They want to offere something different.... better. that includes programming parts of the ecu that we know have been problems for over a year now.... not just ignoring them and offering flashes when your shit doesnt run right.... or worse breaks... to make it better then.

Hate to be naysayer, but I seriously doubt they'd be able to address every possible issue before release. There will always be some tweaking needed after the fact. My beef is they seem willing to bash even though they obviously haven't figured it all out yet. Hell, their piggy backs are far from perfect.

[phailerider]

Originally Posted by Betelgeuse Hate to be naysayer, but I seriously doubt they'd be able to address every possible issue before release. There will always be some tweaking needed after the fact. My beef is they seem willing to bash even though they obviously haven't figured it all out yet. Hell, their piggy backs are far from perfect.

bro... much of the anger is directed at Cobb to some extent not because we dont believe that the prodcut will be fine in time but the fact that they released an imperfect product and immediately started nutswinging behind closed doors how lousy the piggybacks were.

There has been an organized plan at Cobb to get the word out..."piggybacks suck". Just because you havent been one of the dozens in direct contact with them, where youve heard it from their mouths doesnt mean it isnt true. its been obvious around here. Your guns are drawn at the wrong crowd if its bashing that concerns you.

Most of the guys who are "bashing Cobb" now... were having similar issues wiht CPE for the last year or so. Doesnt it make you question why they would just turn their hate around when it was Cobb that they were all kneeling before earlier? Cobbs playing hardball and they should... but its OK to talk about the competion and for them to defend themselves to.

Last point..... I think its inconceivable to not say that the car has trouble in the cold, issues with throttle, and even fuel pressure problems in stock+ form. Cobb claims this isnt the case. Everybody else disagrees. Thats why CPE is still programming.....the main concerns with our cars... The gains Cobb have gotten arent better then what the piggy tuned guys have had themselves for the last year anyway. Hell the mbc/bcd guys were getting better stuff...lol

I just bought a GTI and researching VWs, its obvious that these DI motors have fueling issues and need upgraded pumps....OBVIOUS. Cobb is a rookie when it comes to DI... they dont get it yet. And their simple flashes are not solving all the "known" problems either. They deny they exist. We'll see if their right.

Cpe spent the last year fighting off cold weather issues with their users. We'll see what happens this fall when cars start fuel cutting and they dont have a fix. To say its not an issue so you didnt tune it is just crazy.... it means you'll have to tune it later...lol It just shows how little they really knew about this car before they started to stick it on a dyno and start changing values.

[Haltech]

Let's not let this turn into another pissing match. All it does is take the good info and turn it into liquid dogshit. People should be excited either way about CP-e's flash, even if you prefer Cobb. Why? options.. How many of those did we have a year ago? I rest my case.

[Betelgeuse]

Originally Posted by Haltech Let's not let this turn into another pissing match. All it does is take the good info and turn it into liquid dogshit. People should be excited either way about CP-e's flash, even if you prefer Cobb. Why? options.. How many of those did we have a year ago? I rest my case.

Yeah I'm done venting. I agree with you regarding competition and it's definitely good to see more interest in us.


Palerider: I get what you're saying but you can't deny Cobb's working their asses off. It's not like they just left everyone in the cold.


Anyway like Haltec said, this is going down a bad road. I'll be the first to eat my words if CP-E really pulls this off without a hitch.

Just a general question- what's going on with the ms6 guys? I'd think CP-E would be working full time on a flash for them as well. Are they?

[Haltech]

Yup, they are supporting MS3,MS6 and also the CX7 markets.

[NYpest]

Can someone please explain the whole "tempature" problem EXCLUDING the devices used to increase the boost and fool sensors ?? has there been anyone using the stock tune with whatever mods find this problem?

[4thStroke]

Please leave the vendor-nutswinging to m247 and m3f..... this is the forum for factual information and no bullshit. Thanks.

Remember bro, that nutsack swings both ways. It wasnt until loosh and palerider went to CP-E themselves and loved what they saw that the boards really were so "pro CP-E." Until then, nobody knew what to think, you hated them or loved them. It seems now, most people nutswinging off of CP-E's sack.

And as far as Cobb puting down piggybacks, they have their methods of tuning a vehicle and CP-E has theirs, and its not like CP-E hasnt ever spoken harsh words to other companies.

Regardless, what CP-E will offer is another OTS tune, correct? There will still be more power to be made, and in the end, both products are capable of producing the same numbers.

[dadasracecar]

Originally Posted by 4thStroke And as far as Cobb puting down piggybacks, they have their methods of tuning a vehicle and CP-E has theirs, and its not like CP-E hasnt ever spoken harsh words to other companies. Regardless, what CP-E will offer is another OTS tune, correct? There will still be more power to be made, and in the end, both products are capable of producing the same numbers.

Umm, nope. I don't recall cp-e ever putting down another supplier publicly. Ever.

cp-e is offering a flash that will benefit the casual guy but will really make the the standback that much more effective, e.g. better closed to open loop transition, open throttle plate, temperature effect mitigation, etc. The standback is modifiable and any tuner can do so. You don't have to be a COBB minion to tune with it.

As for the numbers, we'll wait to see what cp-e produces. I have yet to see any impressive numbers from COBB.

[4thStroke]

Umm, nope. I don't recall cp-e ever putting down another supplier publicly. Ever.

Not here, but it has been done before. If you are certain it hasnt, feel free to PM me.

I hope what CP-E comes out with does put the Cobb stuff to shame, maybe thats what it will take for Cobb to really start to push these cars. Cobb really should have more aggressive tunes for the car, and being an AP owner myself, I cant wait to ditch the OTS maps and get protuned. I was just wondering what I was going to do with my AP once I go stage 2. Many people have better luck with the stock tune when stage 2, when I get my downpipe and race pipe next week, I will have a decent amount of testing to do between the 2.

the 280whp and 315 or so wtq impressed with intake and turboback exhaust. Its going to be very interesting to see what CP-E is going to do with the tune.

The next few months are going to be exciting in the MS3 community.

[phailerider]

Fwiw... I have had lots of personal discussions with both christian and the cpe guys over the last month. cobb was vocal and everywhere on the boards.... cpe was not.

christian made some pretty direct statements about standback tuning and made some pretty direct claims about the AP flashs as well. meeting the cpe guys and hearing the rebuttal was eyeopening to say the least. To think loosh was blown off his feet with an actual sitdown with Lou is an understatement..... and quite an endorsement for their techniques, products, and engineering. Loosh is a bulshit hound and there was none of that. open dialogue and witness to things that would blow you guys away.... I wish i could talk about it more.

I nutswing nobody. Ive been offered stuff from everybody and ive paid for every goddam part on my car because i chose it. Dont anybody think Ive got some hidden agenda.

Bottom line is that after that weekend, coming back to the Cobb AP "loss of power/ issue" threads, and hearing more inside info from both companies.... it is very difficult to not sort of be rooting for the underdog here.

Both products will probably be great in the end... they'll cheat off each other. but for now, when CPE releases their product with some of the information that will be discussed then..... well i just have to keep my mouth shut.

there are no hidden agendas. if cobb produces the flashes we all thought they would then it becomes a moot issue. they are walmart.... they will be difficult to overcome, but I am rooting for option b as well. It will force cobb to do a better job with our ecus then they have done so far. and that means a more intensive round of decoding than I believe they have in this thing at the present.

[Laloosh]

laloosh is a bullshit hound? What exactly does that mean? lol

[4thStroke]

Nicely put, pale.

And like I said, nothing against CP-E. I wish they were more active on the boards.

[Haltech]

Originally Posted by Laloosh laloosh is a bullshit hound? What exactly does that mean? lol

Well, to put it lightly, you really do think every company out there bullshits you.

[Laloosh]

not every company out there, just 90 percent of the mazda ones

[Haltech]

Originally Posted by Laloosh not every company out there, just 90 percent of the mazda ones

So, i guess it comes down to only companies who build suspension products for you than, lol.

[Darksun280]

Originally Posted by Haltech So, i guess it comes down to only companies who build suspension products for you than, lol.

Yup that sounds about right. LOL

[TRU-BOOST]

so another generic off the shelf tune ?? and then buy the standback along with it just to get a respecable tune ?? yeah OK. if either one of cp-e's tuning deviced was worth a damn it would not need the other one to be used along with it. what a joke.

[dadasracecar]

Wow, obviously you haven't been paying attention...

The cp-e flash will work to improve the closed loop/open loop transition, keep the throttle plate open, and deal with temperature related problems. All of which will enhance the standback's effectiveness. THat way you can tune it yourself or pay a local shop a normal rate rather than have to go to a COBB affiliate.