LC/FFS question

[glndrums]

Alright, I know around 4400 is the best rpm...what about the speed setting 12-15mph?

Whats a good method of releasing the clutch when in 2-step...popping off it, or rolling off it?

Also, I just hit 120mi on my Stage 2 Map, if I set up the LC/FFS on the AP and re-load my map to ecu, do I still have to wait the 50-100mi even if I havent changed the map in any way and my MAF is just fine right now??

Thanks guys!!

[glndrums]

9 views and no replies?? what gives gents?

[silvapain]

I'm assuming MS6? I can't see shit on Tapatalk.

The LC speed needs to be as high as possible without hitting the point where the speed is equal to or greater than where the car normally would be at that RPM in 1st.

The whole point of LC is to drop the clutch with the pedal floored.

You only need to do that 50 mile crap if you are calibrating your MAF. If it's already calibrated, you cam go WOT immediately.


Tapadatass

[laxplayermjd]

yes ig maf cal is good its ok to do wot since your afr target should be spot on. it may see be wise to run it atleast 20 miles varying load and rpm.

Do you have diff mounts? Id suggest not using launch control until you do. speed for lc is just basicallly a limit. Keep it low. You really shouldnt be using launch control if your rolling, set it at 5mph personally.


I dump the clutch when ffs. Drive it however you like to drive it


and everytime you reflash you do reset the ecu.

[speedms6]

Originally Posted by silvapain I'm assuming MS6? I can't see shit on Tapatalk. The LC speed needs to be as high as possible without hitting the point where the speed is equal to or greater than where the car normally would be at that RPM in 1st. The whole point of LC is to drop the clutch with the pedal floored. You only need to do that 50 mile crap if you are calibrating your MAF. If it's already calibrated, you cam go WOT immediately. Tapadatass

don't listen to this, the second part is true about the maf cal, if you're maf cal is spot on, i would personally still give ti like 20 miels or so with varying throttle, but really isnt necessary, as for the launch control, do not listen to this guy

Originally Posted by laxplayermjd yes ig maf cal is good its ok to do wot since your afr target should be spot on. it may see be wise to run it atleast 20 miles varying load and rpm. Do you have diff mounts? Id suggest not using launch control until you do. speed for lc is just basicallly a limit. Keep it low. You really shouldnt be using launch control if your rolling, set it at 5mph personally. I dump the clutch when ffs. Drive it however you like to drive it and everytime you reflash you do reset the ecu.

this is better, 5 mph is good, bc as he said, you really shouldnt be launching your car if its moving, no reason to, and also for launching, especially with the ms6 all wheel drive you should not be dumping the clutch either as stated in the first quote, you should be feathering it, it will take a little practice, but after some launches, you'll figure out how much and how fast to let out on the clutch yields you the best smoothest results, with flat foot, its pretty much dumping the clutch, in the lower gears i'll still let it catch maybe a little bit

[glndrums]

Originally Posted by speedms6 don't listen to this, the second part is true about the maf cal, if you're maf cal is spot on, i would personally still give ti like 20 miels or so with varying throttle, but really isnt necessary, as for the launch control, do not listen to this guy this is better, 5 mph is good, bc as he said, you really shouldnt be launching your car if its moving, no reason to, and also for launching, especially with the ms6 all wheel drive you should not be dumping the clutch either as stated in the first quote, you should be feathering it, it will take a little practice, but after some launches, you'll figure out how much and how fast to let out on the clutch yields you the best smoothest results, with flat foot, its pretty much dumping the clutch, in the lower gears i'll still let it catch maybe a little bit

Thanks man, Im gonna play around a bit and see if I can get the launch down...diff mounts are in the near future.

[Mistersix]

I need to jack your thread and ask if anybody knows what would cause LC to be active without the clutch disengaged.

If i'm sitting still with the car idling and floor the throttle (clutch out) it only rev's to my LC limit. But when i'm moving faster than the LC's speed limit the regular rev limiter works.



If it helps my setting are:

FFS: 5500k
LC: 3500k
LC speed limit: 6.21
Normal rev limit: 6700
Speed hysteresis: 3.50

[silvapain]

Originally Posted by Mistersix I need to jack your thread and ask if anybody knows what would cause LC to be active without the clutch disengaged. If i'm sitting still with the car idling and floor the throttle (clutch out) it only rev's to my LC limit. But when i'm moving faster than the LC's speed limit the regular rev limiter works. If it helps my setting are: FFS: 5500k LC: 3500k LC speed limit: 6.21 Normal rev limit: 6700 Speed hysteresis: 3.50

That's how LC is supposed to work. LC sets the rev limiter lower until you exceed a certain vehicle speed. It's independent of clutch position.

FFS is the control that's only active at WOT with the clutch depressed.


Tapadatass

[Mistersix]

Originally Posted by silvapain That's how LC is supposed to work. LC sets the rev limiter lower until you exceed a certain vehicle speed. It's independent of clutch position. FFS is the control that's only active at WOT with the clutch depressed. Tapadatass

I see what your saying but i don't remember that ever being the issue before. See i was trying to log for MAF calibration, and when i went to rev the engine up to 30g/s in neutral i topped out at my LC limit.

I've never had that problem before the new map and firmware was installed. I always had to push the clutch in to get the LC active otherwise it was the normal rev limit. Not to mention when i'm moving in neutral i can rev it to redline as long as the clutch is out. Maybe i should ask COBB.

[evidence]

Originally Posted by Mistersix I see what your saying but i don't remember that ever being the issue before. See i was trying to log for MAF calibration, and when i went to rev the engine up to 30g/s in neutral i topped out at my LC limit. I've never had that problem before the new map and firmware was installed. I always had to push the clutch in to get the LC active otherwise it was the normal rev limit. Not to mention when i'm moving in neutral i can rev it to redline as long as the clutch is out. Maybe i should ask COBB.

It has always been this way. The inverse is the LC limit isn't present when the clutch is in, and then what good would it do? When you dropped the clutch and took off you would have no limit and redline it and start spinning immediately with enough power. That's what the MPH limit is for, keeps you under the LC irrelevant of everything else so you don't start spinning.

[silvapain]

Launch control is for hard launches when racing. Why would you use launch control and then feather the clutch? You don't use LC when putzing about town normally.

Also, 5mph may be too low for LC as if there's any wheel spin at all you'll be right above that speed immediately. I don't have any experience with launching the MS6 so I wouldn't know for sure.


Tapadatass

[speedms6]

Originally Posted by silvapain Launch control is for hard launches when racing. Why would you use launch control and then feather the clutch? You don't use LC when putzing about town normally. Also, 5mph may be too low for LC as if there's any wheel spin at all you'll be right above that speed immediately. I don't have any experience with launching the MS6 so I wouldn't know for sure. Tapadatass

hard launches is how you break things, im not talking about riding the clutch, but u gotta feather it a little, and as for the ms6 since its all wheel drive there will be hardly anyway wheel spin, if any, so its ok, and if you're driivng an ms3 im pretty sure you guys should be feathering the clutch to so your not just spinning your tires off the line

[silvapain]

LOL. I spin my tires all the way through first and all the way through second even with using LC. No way around it without putting on R-comp's.


Tapadatass

[evidence]

Originally Posted by silvapain LOL. I spin my tires all the way through first and all the way through second even with using LC. No way around it without putting on R-comp's. Tapadatass

Tune your load or throttle in gears 1/2 down properly to give you just a tad bit of spin/chirping and you'll actually be faster (and extend the life of the tires).

In an MS3 you still need to feather the clutch otherwise you'll just sit there spinning at your LC RPM.

[Mistersix]

No spinning here, and i understand what your saying. I think i'm being misunderstood. Maybe its the way i worded everything. I'm going to contact cobb or maybe make a thread. This could be a legit topic.

[evidence]

Originally Posted by Mistersix No spinning here, and i understand what your saying. I think i'm being misunderstood. Maybe its the way i worded everything. I'm going to contact cobb or maybe make a thread. This could be a legit topic.

Holding RPMs before launch is the easy part though, you don't need LC to do that if all you want is to hold 3k while the clutch is out. Just find 3k in your pedal and hold it there. The benefit of LC is you don't have to feather the gas/clutch as much and find the balance, you can mostly just go all out.

[Mistersix]

Originally Posted by evidence Holding RPMs before launch is the easy part though, you don't need LC to do that if all you want is to hold 3k while the clutch is out. Just find 3k in your pedal and hold it there. The benefit of LC is you don't have to feather the gas/clutch as much and find the balance, you can mostly just go all out.

What i'm saying is, if i'm just sitting there in the car and its running. I begin to push the throttle, not all the way just enough to get it up to, we'll say, 4400 rpm. The tach stops at 3.5k. Which is currently where i have my LC set. If i floor it, 3.5k. If i push the clutch in and floor it, 3.5k. If i push the clutch in and just give it a little gas, 3.5k.

Its not that i don't know how to use LC or set it. Or how to launch my car. The question is why won't my car let me rev the engine freely.

I've never had this issue before, and never even realized it was an issue until i tried to calibrate my MAF. Part of the procedure for maf cal is getting a log to base corrections from. I'm not going to explain the whole thing but at one point, while monitoring grams/sec you rev the engine, while sitting still in neutral clutch out, until you see 30gm/s. I can't because my car will only rev to 3500 rpms.

I realize now that i've hijacked the wrong thread, and as i've stated in other post, i may need to take this topic somewhere else. In this thread, its misleading. And the matter at hand is hard to explain.

I appreciate everyone's attempt to help.

[evidence]

Originally Posted by Mistersix What i'm saying is, if i'm just sitting there in the car and its running. I begin to push the throttle, not all the way just enough to get it up to, we'll say, 4400 rpm. The tach stops at 3.5k. Which is currently where i have my LC set. If i floor it, 3.5k. If i push the clutch in and floor it, 3.5k. If i push the clutch in and just give it a little gas, 3.5k. Its not that i don't know how to use LC or set it. Or how to launch my car. The question is why won't my car let me rev the engine freely. I've never had this issue before, and never even realized it was an issue until i tried to calibrate my MAF. Part of the procedure for maf cal is getting a log to base corrections from. I'm not going to explain the whole thing but at one point, while monitoring grams/sec you rev the engine, while sitting still in neutral clutch out, until you see 30gm/s. I can't because my car will only rev to 3500 rpms. I realize now that i've hijacked the wrong thread, and as i've stated in other post, i may need to take this topic somewhere else. In this thread, its misleading. And the matter at hand is hard to explain. I appreciate everyone's attempt to help.

This is relevant to the thread as it pertains to the function of LC. I'm well aware of what your speaking of, I've been using ATR for 2+ years and have tuned a handful of speeds. Since the LC/FFS features have been implemented it has always functioned this way. No matter the state of any other component, if your not over your LC speed, you cannot go over your LC RPM. I spoke with Travis@Cobb on this exact scenario 2 years ago, I'll go see if I can dig up the thread.

Bottom line is you need to remove your LC if you wish to do the idle MAF runing rev.

[Mistersix]

Originally Posted by evidence Bottom line is you need to remove your LC if you wish to do the idle MAF runing rev.

Damn. This is what i was hoping i wouldn't have to do.

[glndrums]

^^this...and your not boosting while just holding 3k, now go wot and let it bounce on LC then your boosting

[dooderek]

must feather clutch. wat i do is get the revs up, as soon as i see the first set of yellow lights, release clutch till i feel slight engagement, then drop. lol before i thought lc was easy as mash gas drop clutch. boy was i wrong

[Mistersix]

So since i have to re-flash. What rpm are you guys setting your LC at? Just curious.

[wolly6973]

I don't think the 30 g/s part of the MAF cal is really necessary.

Most just do the pull in 2nd gear up to 100 g/s and call it good.

[Mistersix]

Originally Posted by wolly6973 I don't think the 30 g/s part of the MAF cal is really necessary. Most just do the pull in 2nd gear up to 100 g/s and call it good.

Yeah when i did the neutral part of the log, all the break points and ltft's were the same as the were in the acceleration part.

So whats your LC set at? I'm wondering what people are using nowadays.

[glndrums]

Originally Posted by Mistersix Yeah when i did the neutral part of the log, all the break points and ltft's were the same as the were in the acceleration part. So whats your LC set at? I'm wondering what people are using nowadays.

I have read that 4400-4500 is the best for a speed6, lots lower for 3s until tires are added...if you you tube there are ppl at 5k+ on speed6s but that is a lost of stress on the drive train..any lower than 4k and it bogs, 5k+ ends up being a 4wheel burn and usually broken shi*

mine is at 4500 and its perfect, i am practicing the feather technique so i save my diff mounts until i can upgrade than ill feather it a lot more aggressively...

my diff mounts have lasted all summer of autox so i think im sitting alright for now.

[Mistersix]

Originally Posted by glndrums I have read that 4400-4500 is the best for a speed6, lots lower for 3s until tires are added...if you you tube there are ppl at 5k+ on speed6s but that is a lost of stress on the drive train..any lower than 4k and it bogs, 5k+ ends up being a 4wheel burn and usually broken shi* mine is at 4500 and its perfect, i am practicing the feather technique so i save my diff mounts until i can upgrade than ill feather it a lot more aggressively... my diff mounts have lasted all summer of autox so i think im sitting alright for now.

Right on. I got one diff mount. But i'm still worried about the skinny rear axles. But like you said, feather the clutch.

[glndrums]

Originally Posted by Mistersix Right on. I got one diff mount. But i'm still worried about the skinny rear axles. But like you said, feather the clutch.

I thought our axels and shit were the only non-Fail items ok n our cars

[Mistersix]

Theres some who have broken the rear axles. If get under the car, you'd agree they look kinda wimpy. If i broke one i would definitely go with these.

The Driveshaft Shop | MAZDA 2006-2007 Mazdaspeed 6 500HP Rear Axles - Mazdaspeed 6 - Mazda - Import Axles

[glndrums]

nice