Car audio install in progress (pics)

[irishking03]

whenever you are in the philly pa area feel free to come do the same to my car. Looks fucking amazing. great job

[802MS3]

specs on amps?

[The Nut]

Originally Posted by Jeremy M i've never heard of people putting resin inside a MDF or wood box to prevent resonation(sp?) but i have heard of people running resin around the box to insure their corners are air tight. he made two sets of molds for each side of the car for the tweet/mid he showed us a pic of how the woofer mold came out, then how the tweeter would look on the other side...he will have a woofer, mid, and tweet on each side.

That makes much more sense. And don't get me wrong OP, I certainly applause your efforts and time spent on your custom build. But I still hold firm to my standing that your highs are gonna get lost/absorbed being all the way down there by the carpet, center console, and peoples legs.

I wish you the best though and would love the opportunity to hear it when your done. I also hope your HU is equipped with its own sound staging or that you'll have a D.S.P. connected to do it.

[LS2toMZR]

Great craftsmanship! One question, where does your left foot go with the dead pedal covered up by speakers? It may be different in person, but the pic makes it look like there's nowhere to put your foot anymore.

[Pseudonym]

Your highs won't get "lost" especially when they're on axis. The carpet will do nothing more than smooth things out since it's not a reflective surface. Legs getting in the way is an issue but it's not a huge concern.

[Captainobvious]

Originally Posted by RBMS3 holy jesus christ... looks awsome man! great job! imo you should of wrapped the boxing in the same carpet cloth. but still looks great ! cant wait to see the finished product man !

Do you mean the box in the trunk? If so, there is a plan for that. 2 more trim pieces layere over the top of what you see, one in either suede or vinyl, and the other in matching black carpet. Then a top trim piece to cover everything which will be in matching black carpet as well so you'd never know anything was back there

Thanks for the compliments.

Originally Posted by RallySportDirect WOW very nice, I can appreciate a high quality car stereo install. Is this just a hobby of yours? If I had to guess I'd say you do or have worked at a stereo install shop at one point with the level of expertise shown here.

A fine compliment, but no I haven't worked at any shops or been formally trained. Just honed a little skill over the years doing some work on my own vehicles and getting great advice from other people on audio forums. Thanks!

Originally Posted by 5doorsoffury I am a little confused with your kick panels. On the driver side kick panel there is a speaker provision that you made in the fist picture but then the pictures further down the passenger side has mids and tweets (square grills)? Your wires are nicely covered. I went with the black loom taped going over the radiator since i was scared or the heat from the turbo. Amp rack looks sweet gj.

Sorry, that confusion is part of the condensed pictures- not your fault.

This will give you a better idea of what you're actually looking at:



Each side houses an 8" midbass deep in the footwell, as well as a planar midrand and tweeter.


Before the midrange and tweeter were added, this is the 8" midbass recessed in the footwell.




hope that helps.

Originally Posted by Mizzle plywood?

Yessir. Plywood construction around (and some fiberglassing there too). Top trim panels may employ an MDF cover since it's easier to route/shape, but the rest is all birch ply.

Originally Posted by The Nut I too don't get the custom kick panel for a 6.5" mid bass driver on one side and mid & tweet on the other. I speak from experience that using the factory locations for components sounds great with upgraded speakers. (And requires a lot less time.) But the idea of spreading 1 channel to 2 sides if the vehicle in the first place makes no sense to me. Your amp board looks clean as hell I will say. Way to go!

The kick panels actually house 8" midbass drivers on each side, as well as an 8" planar midrange (flat looking panel) and a 3" planar tweeter (smaller flat panel).

[Captainobvious]

Ok, I'll be here all day single quoting, so here we go!

Originally Posted by Jeremy M the idea behind using kick panels for a 6.5" midbass, means he will be actually enclosing the mid in a sealed box, which nets you stronger midbass and u can give the midbass more power usually. Also the custom location for his mid/tweet allow him to either aim the tweet/mid on axis or off axis depending on what they need to sound "more" accurate. remember, he's going for a SQL system and may compete. he does not want just a system that is loud, it has to get loud but sound good doing it too

Good points here. My midbasses are 8" though and are not in a sealed enclosure. They are infinite baffle, vented to the outside via cutouts and custom filters in the wheel well behind the plastic well covers. The speakers I'm using have a high QTS and excel with a very large airspace.

Originally Posted by The Nut I invite anyone that wants to, to come hear my system. I built mine over a long period of time using a lot of research into what types of speakers, their locations, and their sound curves when putting mine together. My stereo is fully sound staged for the driver and is of the best audio quality (for the money) that I've heard. I used sound deadening in the doors and custom magnet cups in the factory locations to produce the best possible tonal clarity and still keep a stealth look. The tweets are direction adjustable beneath the factory grills. Because of the way sound waves propogate above 1Khtz, there is nothing to be gained by placing them on the floor, and only on one side. Your highs will get swallowed by the carpet, center console, passengers seat & a passenger. You can ask any members of this forum that live in L.A. and has heard my system. My stereo may not break my windows, but the work I've put in will rival any system costing twice as much.

I'm glad you're enjoying your system It does take some trial and error and tinkering to find the "sweet-spot" of performance/budget and sound. I'm my previous '05 Mazda 3, I did midbass drivers in the doors (again, 8"ers that took a lot of goofy work to make happen) and midrange drivers in the a-pillars. It sounded good, but not where this car is headed. I don't understand you're statement about tweeters and their sound propogation above 1K. Sounds are less directional the lower in frequency, not higher. Plus, 1K is a very hearing sensitive range as well. Having them position adjustable certainly helps you as you can keep them more on axis to prevent beaming issues.

You are correct that kick mounted mids and tweeters can have issues with sound being blocked by legs of the driver (or a passenger should there be one in the car- not a real concern for me though). But the advantages of the kick mounted setup is much more equal path-length differences of the drivers. This can greatly improve your sound by positioning the speakers as far forward and toward the outside of the car as possible. This enables (with proper setup, tuning, install and a host of other considerations of course) you to get a wider and deeper sound stage in the vehicle which is great. Thanks for your feedback! I'd love to see what you're running in your car gear wise. Would you mind sharing?

Originally Posted by JTMS3 My pu has clear and quality sound at low volume and sounds just as sweet at high volume. All I did was rip and replace the shitty Bose's speakers and amp to accomplish this and add some bass in the hatch to level it off. To me this car is too much like tin can with all the rattling from my engine mounts, I can't imagine turning it into one huge speaker with these builds. To each their own and I applaud the build/work and look but its overkill in my opinion. Sent using stupid fucking Swype!

All depends on what you're going for. This vehicle will be used in sound competition events (more on that shortly as I just competed in one)

Originally Posted by krispyskustoms I love the work here but don't have a clue whats going on with the kicks. Am I understanding right that the driver side has a mid bass and the passenger side has a mid bass and tweet? Kick panels are the prefered location for drivers because you can get both sides as close as possible to being the same distance apart. That way the music is reaching your ears at the same time. Someone help me wrap my head around this. Also it's not the flexing of plywood that's the problem. It's that it resonates at the same frequencies as a subwoofer plays. Some competitors use plywood , but will poor resin in the enclosure on each wall to stop the resonating. Just my two cents. Keep up the good work.

Every enclosure resonates to some degree, no matter the material. It resonates more the closer you get to the enclosures "fs" (resonant frequency). MDF or plywood, may as wel lbe a wash. A properly built and braced enclosure made out of MDF or birch ply should serve well whichever material is used. The resin is used to "seal" and can give a little additional strength as well as it's absorbed into the wood. It doesn't "prevent" resonance, but can change the "fs" of the box which changes the frequency at which it is most resonant

Originally Posted by Jeremy M i've never heard of people putting resin inside a MDF or wood box to prevent resonation(sp?) but i have heard of people running resin around the box to insure their corners are air tight. he made two sets of molds for each side of the car for the tweet/mid he showed us a pic of how the woofer mold came out, then how the tweeter would look on the other side...he will have a woofer, mid, and tweet on each side.

Thanks! Yeah, the pictures didn't make it clear I think, so thanks- you're correct!

Originally Posted by irishking03 whenever you are in the philly pa area feel free to come do the same to my car. Looks fucking amazing. great job

Hah! Thanks bro! I'll hook up with you at some point when it's done and wrapped up so you can see/hear it in person.

Originally Posted by 802MS3 specs on amps?

The amps are (2) of the new Zapco Z-150.6 . They are rated at 150w x 6 @4ohms and 450x3 bridged. I run a single channel to each mid and tweeter and bridged channels to each midbass and subwoofer. Plenty of power there for my needs

Originally Posted by The Nut That makes much more sense. And don't get me wrong OP, I certainly applause your efforts and time spent on your custom build. But I still hold firm to my standing that your highs are gonna get lost/absorbed being all the way down there by the carpet, center console, and peoples legs. I wish you the best though and would love the opportunity to hear it when your done. I also hope your HU is equipped with its own sound staging or that you'll have a D.S.P. connected to do it.

I use a Pioneer DEX-P99RS head unit with fully active processing and also employ a Mosconi 6to8 DSP unit for tuning flexibility. It's a bit redundant to have both, but I get a signal output increase into my amps and much better EQ-ability with the DSP piece so for now at least, it stays. I do all of the tuning myself using various methods including laptop/RTA, white/pink noise tracks, and tunign by ear with reference material.

Originally Posted by LS2toMZR Great craftsmanship! One question, where does your left foot go with the dead pedal covered up by speakers? It may be different in person, but the pic makes it look like there's nowhere to put your foot anymore.

My dead pedal has been removed to allow for the custom installation of the speakers. I don't use the dead pedal as a footrest anyway so it's no bother to me. I know some really use it though and wouldn't want to lose it. To each their own I rest my left leg against the driver door as that's where I find it comfortable.







Now, as for the sound...

I competed in my first and only SQ show this year in both the MECA and IASCA organizations at the Pennsylvania state finals. This vehicle took first place trophies in both organizations in my class. I think it's good validation that I'm on the right track, but I do still have more work to do. I still have cosmetic panels to wrap up and a full retune to do with a few changes made.

Thanks for all of the positive comments and criticisms- much appreciated!

[RBMS3]

damn bro ima have to fly you over here lol looks extremely great !

[The Nut]

Now that I see the actual set up I'm happy to put my foot in my mouth. Like I stated previously, it originally looked like you were dividing one channel to both the driver and passenger sides of the car. I wasn't picturing you having the mid bass driver and the mids and tweets on both sides because 1) of your original picture & 2) I couldn't visualize how you'd fit everything for a full 3 piece set up on both sides. I'm unfamiliar with your amps, but I'm now sure you new what you were doing when you picked them.
Anyway, congrats on the masterful build, esp taking all that on yourself. All my equipment is in my signature.

What are you doing for mids and tweets in the rear of the vehicle? And are you doing anything with the OEM speaker locations? Obviously you don't need to answer that concerning your sub.

[impossible]

Originally Posted by soul.survivor Zapco makes really nice amps...used to have a couple of them. Not sure why you're using plywood for the sub box though, seems like MDF would be a much better choice due to resonance. Oh yea, might be a little late but you can remove the cowl pretty easily and run the power under it for a cleaner look.

^ this.. Nice sub in a not so nice box doesn't do much for sound quality..Did you make the box using cu ft recommendations?

[Captainobvious]

Originally Posted by The Nut Now that I see the actual set up I'm happy to put my foot in my mouth. Like I stated previously, it originally looked like you were dividing one channel to both the driver and passenger sides of the car. I wasn't picturing you having the mid bass driver and the mids and tweets on both sides because 1) of your original picture & 2) I couldn't visualize how you'd fit everything for a full 3 piece set up on both sides. I'm unfamiliar with your amps, but I'm now sure you new what you were doing when you picked them. Anyway, congrats on the masterful build, esp taking all that on yourself. All my equipment is in my signature. What are you doing for mids and tweets in the rear of the vehicle? And are you doing anything with the OEM speaker locations? Obviously you don't need to answer that concerning your sub.

No sweat
As for the speakers, there are none in use for the rear. My personal opinion is that in an SQ system like this, they are not necessary and actually detract from the sound. I decided to go with the Zapco amps because of the excellent sound quality and substantial power available in 6 channel amps.

I don't currently use any of the stock speaker locations. All of the original OEM speakers are still in there, just not in use.

Originally Posted by impossible ^ this.. Nice sub in a not so nice box doesn't do much for sound quality..Did you make the box using cu ft recommendations?

I'd love to hear why people claim "resonance" as an issue with using birch ply over MDF? It seems a bit silly to me. If a box is properly built and braced, there shouldn't be any issue with resonance, whether it's made out of ply or mdf. Every box, no matter how large or small will resonate to some degree. Each box of any size and construction will have an enclosure "fs" (resonant frequency) at which the enclosure is most resonant. Depending on the passband the speaker is playing, it may actually be moot what that FS actually is.

The enclosure recommended by JL is 0.8 cubic feet. I chose to build this one a little over that to get closer to 1 cubic foot to allow for a shallower roll-off and more extended low frequency response. I chose to use birch ply over mdf for several reasons.

[impossible]

Originally Posted by Captainobvious No sweat As for the speakers, there are none in use for the rear. My personal opinion is that in an SQ system like this, they are not necessary and actually detract from the sound. I decided to go with the Zapco amps because of the excellent sound quality and substantial power available in 6 channel amps. I don't currently use any of the stock speaker locations. All of the original OEM speakers are still in there, just not in use. I'd love to hear why people claim "resonance" as an issue with using birch ply over MDF? It seems a bit silly to me. If a box is properly built and braced, there shouldn't be any issue with resonance, whether it's made out of ply or mdf. Every box, no matter how large or small will resonate to some degree. Each box of any size and construction will have an enclosure "fs" (resonant frequency) at which the enclosure is most resonant. Depending on the passband the speaker is playing, it may actually be moot what that FS actually is. The enclosure recommended by JL is 0.8 cubic feet. I chose to build this one a little over that to get closer to 1 cubic foot to allow for a shallower roll-off and more extended low frequency response.

I've always known MDF to be the better construction material for enclosures (ran 2 SA-12's at 2,400Watts RMS + in a box tuned low around 33-32hz in my last car ) but you might be right, I never read into it much. I really like your subs location though, but I can't decide wether I want that placement or in the corner of the hatch firing to the passenger side -_-

[The Nut]

Originally Posted by Captainobvious No sweat As for the speakers, there are none in use for the rear. My personal opinion is that in an SQ system like this, they are not necessary and actually detract from the sound. I decided to go with the Zapco amps because of the excellent sound quality and substantial power available in 6 channel amps. I don't currently use any of the stock speaker locations. All of the original OEM speakers are still in there, just not in use. I'd love to hear why people claim "resonance" as an issue with using birch ply over MDF? It seems a bit silly to me. If a box is properly built and braced, there shouldn't be any issue with resonance, whether it's made out of ply or mdf. Every box, no matter how large or small will resonate to some degree. Each box of any size and construction will have an enclosure "fs" (resonant frequency) at which the enclosure is most resonant. Depending on the passband the speaker is playing, it may actually be moot what that FS actually is. The enclosure recommended by JL is 0.8 cubic feet. I chose to build this one a little over that to get closer to 1 cubic foot to allow for a shallower roll-off and more extended low frequency response. I chose to use birch ply over mdf for several reasons.

Polyfill mod.

[Captainobvious]

Originally Posted by impossible I've always known MDF to be the better construction material for enclosures (ran 2 SA-12's at 2,400Watts RMS + in a box tuned low around 33-32hz in my last car ) but you might be right, I never read into it much. I really like your subs location though, but I can't decide wether I want that placement or in the corner of the hatch firing to the passenger side -_-

Depends on what you're willing to give up I guess. A lot of people seem to be happy with JTMS3's boxes that utilize the corner (and keep the spare tire in place), but it does limit box size and options.

[JTMS3]

Originally Posted by Captainobvious Depends on what you're willing to give up I guess. A lot of people seem to be happy with JTMS3's boxes that utilize the corner (and keep the spare tire in place), but it does limit box size and options.

Don't get me wrong it does minimize size (which is the point) but unless you want a 15" sub I got it covered. @Oalmon; can give you opinions on his 12" sub box.

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk

[Oalmon]

box is a beast I love it honestly my car guy that I buy the majority of my system parts and other non fast parts from even thought it was tits. Honestly a 12 is really more than is needed I keep mine at -3 or -2 at all times and it doesn't make the hatch rattle. (Jlw6v2) @JTMS3; did a great job on them I HIGHLY recommend his boxes esp if u want to keep the majority of your hatch space


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - now Free

[Hatchbackfan]

Quite the level of craftsmanship on this system subbed to see the final results

[-=max=-]

Looking good! Have not been on DIYMA lately, but thinking of doing a small install.

Have you even opened the doors up yet? I don't want to go kicks, but my doors rattle with the stock mids cant imagine how bad they will be with some real speakers.

[Captainobvious]

Originally Posted by -=max=- Looking good! Have not been on DIYMA lately, but thinking of doing a small install. Have you even opened the doors up yet? I don't want to go kicks, but my doors rattle with the stock mids cant imagine how bad they will be with some real speakers.

Nope, I didn't bother to. I saw pictures of what they look like. They still have the plastic inner door piece and the cutout in the metal for the speaker is oddly shaped. I didn't feel like messing with a door rebuild again and wanted to try the midbass in kicks. I'm happy now that I did. I get no resonance from the midbasses now which is nearly impossible to do with doors.

[The Nut]

No resonance in mine.

[The Nut]

No unwanted vibes of any kind....as long as sunglasses aren't in the sunglass holder.

[The Nut]

By the way Capt. @Captainobvious;, how's the sound tuning coming?

[Captainobvious]

Originally Posted by The Nut By the way Capt. @Captainobvious;, how's the sound tuning coming?

I'm actually in the process of tweaking a couple of things so tuning will happen again after that.


RE: doors- It's really a question of the pass band they will be playing and how much energy they are transferring to the doors. In my case, I'm using 8" woofers in midbass duties only, with 450watts on each... so they would rattle the hell out of those doors

With a standard 6.5" and plenty of door treatment, you can probably get away with it though.

[The Nut]

Originally Posted by Captainobvious I'm actually in the process of tweaking a couple of things so tuning will happen again after that. RE: doors- It's really a question of the pass band they will be playing and how much energy they are transferring to the doors. In my case, I'm using 8" woofers in midbass duties only, with 450watts on each... so they would rattle the hell out of those doors With a standard 6.5" and plenty of door treatment, you can probably get away with it though.

Yeah. I have mine cut of at 60htz and only 120w rms/max going to them. So the sound is clean.

[-=max=-]

Just ordered a set of Zaph 5" for the doors. Plan on doing a passenger footwell sub crossed over pretty high and keep the doors crossed over as high as possible.
Another questio, how loud are the 8s outside of the car? Running IB in the kicks, I'm wondering how much gets out.

[Captainobvious]

Originally Posted by -=max=- Just ordered a set of Zaph 5" for the doors. Plan on doing a passenger footwell sub crossed over pretty high and keep the doors crossed over as high as possible. Another question, how loud are the 8s outside of the car? Running IB in the kicks, I'm wondering how much gets out.

Ohhh, it's audible You can definitely hear some of the lower midrange/midbass outside of the car if it's turned up. That's because they are vented to the exterior though. If you vent into the framerails, you will hear far less outside the car.

Sounds like a nice plan with the Zaph's. I hope the 5" can play low enough for a smooth transition between the sub and midbass. Make sure the sub you use has a very low inductance Le and low distortion so that it will be able to play higher in frequency.

I have a sub in the passenger footwell I've been testing as well, and have demoed others. They certainly help to bring the bass 'up front' for a more realistic presentation.
Let me know how it goes, I'd love to see some pics and see your build progress.

[Captainobvious]

Originally Posted by The Nut No unwanted vibes of any kind....as long as sunglasses aren't in the sunglass holder.

Yeah that thing is a noisy little fucker isn't it?

[The Nut]

Originally Posted by Captainobvious Yeah that thing is a noisy little fucker isn't it?

Yup

[[]V[]addog]

that system is insane! nice work man,

[Captainobvious]

Thank you, sir!
Sorry...haven't logged on in a bit.

[OSN]

Any updates?

[Captainobvious]

Fancy seeing you over here now

I will have some updates coming for sure over the next few months. Reconfiguring things in the system and am changing speakers and amps out.


Moving to a pillar/sail panel install for the mids and tweeters with midbasses remaining in the kicks.

[The Nut]

Originally Posted by Captainobvious Moving to a pillar/sail panel install for the mids and tweeters with midbasses remaining in the kicks.

Umm....told ya so?

[JTMS3]

Originally Posted by Captainobvious Moving to a pillar/sail panel install for the mids and tweeters with midbasses remaining in the kicks.

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk

[Captainobvious]

Originally Posted by The Nut Umm....told ya so?

Told me what?

[Captainobvious]

Ahhh, ok...found it.

Originally Posted by The Nut I invite anyone that wants to, to come hear my system. I built mine over a long period of time using a lot of research into what types of speakers, their locations, and their sound curves when putting mine together. My stereo is fully sound staged for the driver and is of the best audio quality (for the money) that I've heard. I used sound deadening in the doors and custom magnet cups in the factory locations to produce the best possible tonal clarity and still keep a stealth look. The tweets are direction adjustable beneath the factory grills. Because of the way sound waves propogate above 1Khtz, there is nothing to be gained by placing them on the floor, and only on one side. Your highs will get swallowed by the carpet, center console, passengers seat & a passenger. You can ask any members of this forum that live in L.A. and has heard my system. My stereo may not break my windows, but the work I've put in will rival any system costing twice as much.

Originally Posted by The Nut That makes much more sense. And don't get me wrong OP, I certainly applause your efforts and time spent on your custom build. But I still hold firm to my standing that your highs are gonna get lost/absorbed being all the way down there by the carpet, center console, and peoples legs. I wish you the best though and would love the opportunity to hear it when your done. I also hope your HU is equipped with its own sound staging or that you'll have a D.S.P. connected to do it.

There were several reasons for me wanting the change, but mostly in the pursuit of even better sound. Would I say it was a failure having them mounted and aimed as they were? Certainly not. My car did exceedingly well in the MECA (2nd place) and IASCA (1st place) state finals for PA in it's maiden voyage in competition. I think aiming kick mounted mids/tweeters more off axis is a better way to go so that you're getting mostly equal reflective sound and you have to worry far less about direct sound being blocked by legs. I knew it could be bothersome from the get go, but the car still performed brilliantly.
That said, I wanted to try some different speakers I've been eyeing up for some time. Because of the type of speakers they are (dome mid), they are best suited for a high door/pillar/dash install. I also would like the kick area to look more stock and compact. I'll be doing the dome mids in the pillars and the tweeters in the sail panels with a different aiming configuration. The only reason for this is to achieve a little greater width vs depth which can be achieved with the mid location chosen.

I'm moving to some more efficent, higher powered amplifiers that should be pretty amazing.

Thanks for the continued comments and suggestions guys.

[Captainobvious]

Been a while since updates, so here are a few...

I commissioned a friend and legendary installer Mark Worrell of North Carolina to build a set of a pillars for the car. While I have the ability to build pillars myself, I wouldnt be able to finish them to the quality level he is able to. In addition, I'd rather spend the time doing some other things. Mark will also be doing some more work which is yet to come later this month.

The Zapco amps are out and I am installing a Zed Audio amplifier setup which will consist of (2) Leviathan III amps and (1) Minotaur III. While I wait for the work Mark will be doing for me, I build a few temporary pieces to get me by until then. They are quick and certainly imperfect as I just needed a temporary solution.

First up, the trunk amp rack:










Next up are some sail panels:









And a quick mounting solution for the source pieces...








And the uber nice a pillars constructed by Mark Worrell:

[The Nut]

I so t know low you stereo is gonna turn out this time, amazing I'd imagine, but your interior makes my pe-pe tingle. Over-all dash looks sick son! Get a suede head-liner and shazzam!

[Captainobvious]

Hah! Thanks Nut. The mat is a simple Dash Designs black suede unit (they're only like 40-50 bux and look great. The material on the pillars is Alcantara. I'd love to have the dash wrapped in it with some nice red stitching but it's really expensive stuff. Maybe after the audio project I can convince the wife to have it done for me for a bday gift or something.

The trunk is going to be a false floor design still and should be REALLY sick when done. I'll update more as it progresses. The majority of this work will be happening the last week of April, so in a month it should be really transformed.

[The Nut]

I forget, did you dynomat the whole car? Now that my engine's mounts have all gone in, and while they're started to settle, I'm still transmitting a lot of NHV and was thinking of this for future in hopes of chilling that out a bit.