Mazadaspeed Accesstuner Now Available

[atvfreek]

All the guys jumping ship to VT. You can't resell it as far as I know. So unless you are planning on keeping the car forever. Its an invalid point about the small cost of the class. Ford users have had to pay the 150 cost since it came out.

I'll be paying for the class as well, and I don't need to. Maybe its super basic, but after working for 3 different manufacturers, and being forced to take basic classes for each (intro to electrical diag etc) I could have passed each class and tested out, but took it, and learned something new each time. If you enjoy self tuning. I say take it, learn a thing or two, and be happy with life

[SarcasticOne]

Originally Posted by atvfreek All the guys jumping ship to VT. You can't resell it as far as I know. So unless you are planning on keeping the car forever. Its an invalid point about the small cost of the class. Ford users have had to pay the 150 cost since it came out. I'll be paying for the class as well, and I don't need to. Maybe its super basic, but after working for 3 different manufacturers, and being forced to take basic classes for each (intro to electrical diag etc) I could have passed each class and tested out, but took it, and learned something new each time. If you enjoy self tuning. I say take it, learn a thing or two, and be happy with life

Can you report back after you take it?

Am curious to see your opinion on it, and if it's actually useful to the community.

[Mazdazilla6]

Someone halp I dunt understand what all these tables are for! What is load? Is it safe to run 30* of timing at redline? How do I get rid of the check engine light for my cat delete? How much power can I expect to gain from a self tune over an OTS map? What is DBW? Why won't my car hit its boost targets?

[tastyratz]

Disappointing.

I've been tuning my own cars for years. I don't need some remedial class and now something I purchased with support in mind is being kept hostage?

I would gladly watch a video course if it was free, and I could understand slightly if this applied to NEW sales but...

We will see if a class action comes of it.

Guess I should never lose my install file, but if I do I'm losing the ap.

[Dubcnea]

Originally Posted by tastyratz Disappointing. I've been tuning my own cars for years. I don't need some remedial class and now something I purchased with support in mind is being kept hostage? I would gladly watch a video course if it was free, and I could understand slightly if this applied to NEW sales but... We will see if a class action comes of it. Guess I should never lose my install file, but if I do I'm losing the ap.

So this happened to me. I was forced to dump a prior pc and build a new one and the HD was jacked. So no more install file. Now all I really want to do is have the ability to clear some trouble codes (unplugging the EGR, for instance) but to do that I must now pay $150?! Crazy.

Any chance you can send me that install file?! I searched all my backup drives but apparently I did not store it somewhere. I guess I never figured it would end up costing tens of dollars just to get a 'retooled' (though same) copy.

[charlesfist]

Having just wasted about 45 mins of time and 150 bucks on it you need to better define useful to the community.

Its more for someone new to the whole tuning process that needs a basic all in all place to get caught up on what your looking at when you open ATR and maybe start tweeking a few parameters. Even with that its a lot of money in my opinion.

I think (and know) all the free information here on this site is the way you want to go if you really want to learn to tune (safely). After all, look at all the tuners (some turned pro) that gained knowledge from being active on this site.

There is no way to justify this for previous owners and users of ATR, except that cobb had us by the ballz and did what they wanted to plug a leak in their funds, in addition to getting more people to goto protuners. I think there was a conflict there with protuners having to pay cobb for ATR Pro to tune clients while internet tuners could get free software to tune clients.

Just look at this multiple choice question on their quiz:

"When tuning a Mazda its best to always start with a totally stock ROM and work your way up from there"

1. yes, a totally stock ROM insures that you know all the changes that are made to the calibration and this ensures accuracy
2. No, a COBB OTS rom that best matches your modifications and fuel is the best place to start as much of the work and base setting have been already been accomplished
3. Its best to buy a file from an accomplished internet tuner who sells maps to his buddies for beer and pizza

The only reason I did it was because I had no other choice. Not because I was delusional thinking it was going to provide more information or anything close to the vast wealth of knowledge here on this site.

Disclaimer: I have been tuning my own car (thanks to these forums and the knowledgeable folks associated with this site) for a long ass time so am grumpy about being forced into an expensive, unnecessary for me, prostate exam while being told its better for everyone.

tldr: If your new to tuning, its a starter kit (paid source) to get yourself situated. One still needs a lot of hands on to learn successful tuning for which you will have to come back to this site to get your real learn on.

[WetzMS3]

Originally Posted by charlesfist Having just wasted about 45 mins of time and 150 bucks on it you need to better define useful to the community. Its more for someone new to the whole tuning process that needs a basic all in all place to get caught up on what your looking at when you open ATR and maybe start tweeking a few parameters. Even with that its a lot of money in my opinion. I think (and know) all the free information here on this site is the way you want to go if you really want to learn to tune (safely). After all, look at all the tuners (some turned pro) that gained knowledge from being active on this site. There is no way to justify this for previous owners and users of ATR, except that cobb had us by the ballz and did what they wanted to plug a leak in their funds, in addition to getting more people to goto protuners. I think there was a conflict there with protuners having to pay cobb for ATR Pro to tune clients while internet tuners could get free software to tune clients. Just look at this multiple choice question on their quiz: "When tuning a Mazda its best to always start with a totally stock ROM and work your way up from there" 1. yes, a totally stock ROM insures that you know all the changes that are made to the calibration and this ensures accuracy 2. No, a COBB OTS rom that best matches your modifications and fuel is the best place to start as much of the work and base setting have been already been accomplished 3. Its best to buy a file from an accomplished internet tuner who sells maps to his buddies for beer and pizza The only reason I did it was because I had no other choice. Not because I was delusional thinking it was going to provide more information or anything close to the vast wealth of knowledge here on this site. Disclaimer: I have been tuning my own car (thanks to these forums and the knowledgeable folks associated with this site) for a long ass time so am grumpy about being forced into an expensive, unnecessary for me, prostate exam while being told its better for everyone. tldr: If your new to tuning, its a starter kit (paid source) to get yourself situated. One still needs a lot of hands on to learn successful tuning for which you will have to come back to this site to get your real learn on.

Wait, that was legit a question and the multiple choice answers?

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

[doctavus]

Why did you take it then, seems you already have ATR.

And are those seriously on the fucking quiz you pay $150 for??

[charlesfist]

Yup that was a straight copy paste from their quize that you must pass 100%.
can take them as many times as u want seems like.

ive had a built 6 waiting for a tune to start it up for the last few months.
shifted from my gen 1. So yes still have atr for the 3 but needed to move it over to the 6.

[WetzMS3]

Wow.

Frankly, I am offended. I have offered my garage, guidance, and wrenching in exchange for beer, pizza, and handies plenty of times.

Clearly Cobb thinks that's the wrong answer. But what is the right one? Personally, I'd start from scratch over a half as Cobb OTS map. I'm sure that's not the right answer though.

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

[Pu Manchu]

wow, if that's the test, I wonder what that shill @atvfreek; learned from this course.

definitely gonna save someone from ZZB.

[Amaroms3]

I still get no response.

[charlesfist]

I see a lot of you folks were asking about the specific topics covered and cobb doesnt provide an answer (why i dont know) but heres a list of the 27 topics they make u go throu.
The top basic ones are like 1 to 5 min long videos while the mazda specific ones are abt 10 - 15 mins or so each.

General:

What is EFI?
The 4 Stroke Cycle
Trigger and Sync
Critical Sensors
Fuel Injector Properties
Sizing Injectors
Ignition Systems
Capacitive Discharge Ignition
Styles of Engine Management
ECU Requirements
Installation Methods
Tools of the Trade
Choosing a Wideband
Fueling Requirements
Fuel Pressure Regulator
Engine Mapping
The Benefits of EFI
Outro
OE Tuning Approach and COBB Accesstuner

Mazdaspeed Specific:

Platform Specific Tuning Overview
Special features/COBB custom tuning approach
Load
Boost
Fuel
Ignition and Knock control
Workflow

Regulations and responsibility

[WetzMS3]

Originally Posted by charlesfist I see a lot of you folks were asking about the specific topics covered and cobb doesnt provide an answer (why i dont know) but heres a list of the 27 topics they make u go throu. The top basic ones are like 1 to 5 min long videos while the mazda specific ones are abt 10 - 15 mins or so each. General: What is EFI? The 4 Stroke Cycle Trigger and Sync Critical Sensors Fuel Injector Properties Sizing Injectors Ignition Systems Capacitive Discharge Ignition Styles of Engine Management ECU Requirements Installation Methods Tools of the Trade Choosing a Wideband Fueling Requirements Fuel Pressure Regulator Engine Mapping The Benefits of EFI Outro OE Tuning Approach and COBB Accesstuner Mazdaspeed Specific: Platform Specific Tuning Overview Special features/COBB custom tuning approach Load Boost Fuel Ignition and Knock control Workflow Regulations and responsibility

Well, that is exactly the outline EFI provides for it's Introduction to EFI course, plus the Mazdaspeed specific stuff that was all essentially created here years ago. The Intro to EFI course via EFI costs $99 for those of you with working copies of ATR and no desire to hand Cobb an extra $50 for no reason.

[g00s3y]

Wow, what a load of garbage.

First, charging an extra $50 for a course. In which you basically take free information given out by people here over the years, and then put in in your "intro to atr tuning 101" class that needs to be taken because you wanted more money in your pocket. Oh, and the secondary market for the AP to die, because people shouldn't be able to make money off of something they purchased and no longer need.

Second, you talk about how there is nothing new in ATR (so why the fuck can't us older users update if there is nothing new?), but will be addressing issues and things that need to be fixed in a future update (2 weeks?). So users who didn't need to take a basic tuning course, and pay you extra, don't get a fixed version of ATR. But get to continue using the same old version with a bunch of tables that don't work correctly and aren't labeled correctly. Awesome way to support new and old customers at the same time...

Finally

"When tuning a Mazda its best to always start with a totally stock ROM and work your way up from there" 1. yes, a totally stock ROM insures that you know all the changes that are made to the calibration and this ensures accuracy 2. No, a COBB OTS rom that best matches your modifications and fuel is the best place to start as much of the work and base setting have been already been accomplished 3. Its best to buy a file from an accomplished internet tuner who sells maps to his buddies for beer and pizza

Fuck you.

[Amaroms3]

Well put in better words than me

[Polish_Eagle]

Is there anyone that has the installer after this update? I want to take a look at the file and ...... I mean, please just message me so I can help out

[Dubcnea]

Originally Posted by Polish_Eagle Is there anyone that has the installer after this update? I want to take a look at the file and ...... I mean, please just message me so I can help out

this. i would also like to help.

[CleverOne]

I took the course, has less information that you can get just from reading these forums, just another money sink...

Basic engine information and a quick rundown of what you can and cant do with ATR...

The installer files look the same as the old ones, the license.ini file is encrypted. I have run this program through IDA pro to no avail, jumped over the license check and got it to open without the license file but that is as far as i have gotten.

[nindoja]

Originally Posted by CleverOne I took the course, has less information that you can get just from reading these forums, just another money sink... Basic engine information and a quick rundown of what you can and cant do with ATR... The installer files look the same as the old ones, the license.ini file is encrypted. I have run this program through IDA pro to no avail, jumped over the license check and got it to open without the license file but that is as far as i have gotten.

Did you unpack it yet? The actual software package is loaded in memory encrypted. Just skipping the license check from the loader won't help though, because I'm pretty sure the license file is what they use to tie maps to serial numbers.

[CleverOne]

I unpacked it, the actual installer, a license file and a $pluginsdir folder with a few dll in it.

I am very novice with reverse engineering, so i am for sure not going to get very far.

[nindoja]

Originally Posted by CleverOne I unpacked it, the actual installer, a license file and a $pluginsdir folder with a few dll in it. I am very novice with reverse engineering, so i am for sure not going to get very far.

You are looking at the wrong place. The actual ATR program (not the installer) is protected. And that's about all I'll say.

[CleverOne]

Yea, I was just messing around for learning purposes, I do a little coding now and again and respect the hardwork it takes to create software.

[tastyratz]

So is the license ini packed in the installer setup file?

They require you plug in the AP during install which I theorized bound the install to the AP at install.

Can the install file actually work for anyone else with the same AP & platform?

[CleverOne]

Very seriously doubt they would allow a security hole like that.
The license INI file comes with the installer and my guess is it contains the ap serial number. When the installer ask you to plug in your ap, my guess is it verifies the ap serial number and continues the install.

[Caldazar]

so, how about a package where if you are a Certified, Red Seal, ASE, or other licensed auto tech you don't have to do the first part? I already paid my tuition and dues. I learned far more than offered in that intro course?

I'd pay $50 for it, but not $150.

Especially for a product that I already own, and already have, and have had for years.

also I don't see any mention of Windows 10. Yes, I like 7 better, but clearly there are lots of computers out there with 10 on them.

[Dubcnea]

it is quite apparent that the Cobb attitude is:
1. You don't like this model? Fuck you.
2. Why did we do this? We own this so we can do whatever we want.
3. What's your situation? see #1 .

I'll drive around with my fuckin CEL on all day before i pay $150 for this course.

[MyMS6Bucket]

Pssssh had to pay that shit amount just to up my damn idle. Was sick and tired of smokin up like a damn chimney at traffic lights. Fuk you cobb lol j/k

[MSP6]

I was actually going to hop in and "somewhat" defend Cobb, saying that this does make sense for new production cars as what this seems like to me is a 1st step in getting in a position to have OEM manufacturers honor their product under factory warranty. Something like Polestar with Volvo. A year or two and nobody in the new car markets supported by Cobb will have a clue any of this happened, or that it used to be free. Plus this being a "dead" platform etc...

But that beer and pizza comment can't really be taken as anything but a middle finger to MSF which like it or not has built your knowledge base on said "dead" platform. Dick head move Cobb.

[g00s3y]

So, to anyone who has download the "new and improved" ATR... What's it look like? Screenshots? Still have mislabeled tables?

Just make sure to use OTS tunes, because they are better than what you can get from some random guy on the internet who puts random numbers in tables, just to get some beer and pizza...

[Mattyhawk1]

Has there been any knowledge base put together yet with the collection of old base maps? I assume the old archived ATR is bound to the Accessport, so a list of old ATRs by year won't work, or will it? Can someone with my same year use my ATR?

The stories of people having to take a $150 class to raise idle just plain sux.

[g00s3y]

Originally Posted by Mattyhawk1 Has there been any knowledge base put together yet with the collection of old base maps? I assume the old archived ATR is bound to the Accessport, so a list of old ATRs by year won't work, or will it? Can someone with my same year use my ATR? The stories of people having to take a $150 class to raise idle just plain sux.

The only way you can use ATR if you bought an AP before Cobb said "fuck mazda", is if you downloaded your install file before they took it down. They are tied to the S/N of the AP, and therefore the only way you could edit a map for your car, is if you have your own personal copy of ATR saved from when you purchased the AP new.

You can always ask Cobb, and see if they can send you the install file again, you know, for free, like good customer service people would do. But I wouldn't hold my breath expecting any help.

[Dubcnea]

Originally Posted by g00s3y You can always ask Cobb, and see if they can send you the install file again, you know, for free, like good customer service people would do. But I wouldn't hold my breath expecting any help.

I did this. The email chain (in order descending):

ME: I had accesstuner on my pc but had to reformat and lost it. Do you know where I can download another copy?

COBB: We took down ATR earlier this year, and are in the works of re-releasing the program, platform by platform. Subaru and Mazdaspeed are currently available, and others will be rolled out soon!

ME: The only option I see is to download it after taking some class for $175 or something. Is there not another copy I can get without the class?

COBB: That's correct - we now require that you take a $150 online course through EFI University to gain access to the program. We found that it was necessary to ensure that all users have tuning knowledge before using the program, as well as knowledge of emissions regulations relevant to the tuning software. We cannot send out copies without you taking the course first.

I do kinda love watching them tote that "ATR is free!!" but then noting a small fee for a very important class. Gosh I hope I know everything I need to know about emissions in a state that doesn't require emissions tests. christ.

they could have just as easily gotten themselves out of any type of liability by putting a checkbox on the download that says "I promise I know everything I need to know about tuning or can find a guy that does (for pizza and beer) and I promise I won't sue Cobb or hold them responsible if I ZZB."

[Polish_Eagle]

It has nothing to do with emissions or laws. Cobb did this whole course BS because they are trying to monetize the used parts market.

[g00s3y]

Originally Posted by Dubcnea I did this. The email chain (in order descending): ME: I had accesstuner on my pc but had to reformat and lost it. Do you know where I can download another copy? COBB: We took down ATR earlier this year, and are in the works of re-releasing the program, platform by platform. Subaru and Mazdaspeed are currently available, and others will be rolled out soon! ME: The only option I see is to download it after taking some class for $175 or something. Is there not another copy I can get without the class? COBB: That's correct - we now require that you take a $150 online course through EFI University to gain access to the program. We found that it was necessary to ensure that all users have tuning knowledge before using the program, as well as knowledge of emissions regulations relevant to the tuning software. We cannot send out copies without you taking the course first. I do kinda love watching them tote that "ATR is free!!" but then noting a small fee for a very important class. Gosh I hope I know everything I need to know about emissions in a state that doesn't require emissions tests. christ. they could have just as easily gotten themselves out of any type of liability by putting a checkbox on the download that says "I promise I know everything I need to know about tuning or can find a guy that does (for pizza and beer) and I promise I won't sue Cobb or hold them responsible if I ZZB."

Just putting this out there, and I know barely anything about law, but isn't it technically illegal to withhold software that someone had purchased before "terms of purchase" were changed. I mean those of us who paid $650, and it came with ATR and the AP. Why can't Cobb send the "old" version of ATR to people who paid for it? Once again, I know nothing about law, didn't read the terms and all when purchased, so I don't know what Cobb already put in there possibly to prevent this.

I know they won't send it to a second hand buyer, because greed. But the original purchaser should be able to get a copy of it. But that's just what I think, and how I would run my company, because I would want to attract as many new & repeat customers as possible. Not try and drive them away.

[Dano]

Originally Posted by g00s3y Just putting this out there, and I know barely anything about law, but isn't it technically illegal to withhold software that someone had purchased before "terms of purchase" were changed. I mean those of us who paid $650, and it came with ATR and the AP. Why can't Cobb send the "old" version of ATR to people who paid for it? Once again, I know nothing about law, didn't read the terms and all when purchased, so I don't know what Cobb already put in there possibly to prevent this. I know they won't send it to a second hand buyer, because greed. But the original purchaser should be able to get a copy of it. But that's just what I think, and how I would run my company, because I would want to attract as many new & repeat customers as possible. Not try and drive them away.

Corps routinely resend offers with and without notice, with and without liability on their part (depending on how their terms are written). But the onus would be on you to sue them or take the $150 up the ass. Cobb knows this.

Which do you choose

If anyone cared, and owners on all platforms could gain class status, then a suit might be worth it if you could get damages awarded, but those are not likely. best possible outcome/judgement might be that Cobb has to give all original past AP owners free access to ATR for the life of the device,. (Which, at the least, is how they should have handled it.)

Example 1: I have proof of purchase (original AP owner prior to the 2016 money grab) give me ATR. End of story.

Example 2: I bought an AP from a guy (Secondary owner) no access to ATR w/o course.

While I still don't fully agree with example 2, combined with example 1, it would provide some middle ground while also fostering some sense of good will between Cobb and original AP owners.

But no, they went full corporate, out of touch with their base, retard.

This all just further illustrates what the physiological makeup of a corporation is. sociopathic.

[Pu Manchu]

Originally Posted by g00s3y They are tied to the S/N of the AP

has anyone truly confirmed this? I bought the v2 twice, and seem to remember reusing my initial download on the 2nd, but my memory is pretty fuzzy.

[nindoja]

Originally Posted by Pu Manchu has anyone truly confirmed this? I bought the v2 twice, and seem to remember reusing my initial download on the 2nd, but my memory is pretty fuzzy.

Definitely tied to AP S/N

[Sycoa]

I've been out of the mod game for a year or two now, but starting to get back into it this spring. If I'm reading this thread correctly, it's pointless to buy a used APv2 now? If I was to buy one, would I be unable to get someone like stratified to tune my car unless I paid for this course?

[MazdaspeedKills]

I don't think anyone has an issue with having to take a class, if that's what Cobb wants to impose for liability reasons. We have issue with having to pay for it after paying for the AP. It comes off as another price gouge to Cobb customers (particular those that supported you when upgrading their APs to v3 under the promise of greater features and future support). More often than not perception is reality. IMO Cobb just pulled a Plaxico Burress.