RMM testing and review diaries

[mdl3v8]

Originally Posted by Farhan@DM It will be. Thanks for all the feedback guys, both good and bad. Putting a regular hex bolt on that setup will compress the flanges on the bushing. This may eliminate your clunk, but this will reduce the life of the bushing. This is not a solution I'm comfortable with. This is being actively worked, and I'll keep you guys updated on what is causing the problem, and what the recommended solution is. Everyone with the issue will be provided whatever is needed to address the issue. Just asking for a little patience, please. Stock bolt and shoulder bolt are both 12mm. For anyone with a clunk, please list what RMM you're coming from if you could.

Coming from TRZ Dogbone +JBR PMM.

Tightened to 45ft/lbs

Sent from my Samsung GALAXY S III

[Nano91]

Tomorrow I will remove and re do instalalation make sure I didn't mess up will an extra washer depending on what I see, @Farhan@DM; any tips?

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

[morbiddk]

Quick review after installing my DM RMM. There are vibes, about 1/2 of the JBR 88 and it doesn't appear to resonate through the car like the JBR which is good, I'm sure they will settle a little with time. Washer bottomed out on the bolt resulting in the inability to torque to spec and clunking at startup as in previous reports. I also have clunking whenever I reverse and press the throttle and I hesitate to say around turns when releasing and reapplying throttle, however have not been able to recreate that so it could have been a one off.

Hope to get this clunking under control, going to try a couple washers I have sitting around temporarily until a fix is found or suggested. Great mount aside from this clunking.

[WetzMS3]

I have experienced similar clunking that is difficult to pinpoint and re-create so far. The bolt also could me rotated in place when I checked torque yesterday after a couple hundred miles.

I spoke with @Farhan@DM about this yesterday. He will be stopping by my place tomorrow night to inspect things and look into possible causes/fixes. Hopefully the cause is the same for all of us, and a resolution can be found looking at mine.

No doubt Damond Motorsports is working on resolving this minor issue quickly.

[my2k13speed3]

Should I be concerned about the clunking? Should I reinstall my OEM until the issue is ressolved?

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

[mazdaspeedmyk]

I'm going to hold off on installing mine till this issue has some resolution.

[blackms3_71]

so what is the fix so far? just use 2 washers or 1 thicker washer?

[Farhan@DM]

Originally Posted by WetzMS3 No doubt Damond Motorsports is working on resolving this minor issue quickly.

I'm on this like hot sauce on fried chicken. I do apologize that this part isn't perfect out the box, and do appreciate the feedback. The beer warranty is still valid.

The "extra" length in the bolts is there by design, it's about .07". I didn't anticipate the lateral engine movement over .07" to cause a clunk. Seems I was wrong.
Shank diameter is 12mm, same as stock bolt. Thread diameter is 10mm.
The washer on the threaded size is a 10mm washer. It is supposed to be up against the bolt, not the bushing.

The washer that you guys are throwing on there is likely a 7/16 washer. These washers will generally be .06-.1" thick. For anyone feeling adventurous, go out and buy a 7/16 washer, put that on, put on the supplied 10mm washer, and torque it down till you feel it "go solid." The 45 ft-lbs doesn't have to be hit, but get the nut run all the way down and give it a little bit more.

The clunking won't hurt anything, other than my ego. It is unacceptable and will be resolved, but it won't cause any damage.

[Easter Bunny]

Fwiw mine is as close to .07 as I can measure

[Cheapspeed]

For what it's worth I've been getting some clunking with JBR's 88. Usually after engine braking pretty hard then going on throttle again, like something is shifting. This is after a year of having it on. Haven't gotten around to investigating it.

[grazamataz]

Originally Posted by Farhan@DM The washer that you guys are throwing on there is likely a 7/16 washer. These washers will generally be .06-.1" thick. For anyone feeling adventurous, go out and buy a 7/16 washer, put that on, put on the supplied 10mm washer, and torque it down till you feel it "go solid." The 45 ft-lbs doesn't have to be hit, but get the nut run all the way down and give it a little bit more.

I went this route, just put the car back down. I'll report back after some driving. Didn't feel any wiggling in the mount once I had everything tight.

Also, coming from jbr 88
uploadfromtaptalk1401754717070.jpg



phone

[jharris243]

I did the same...threw on another washer in front of the supplied one. No more clunk although there are definitely more vibes now than before. I just tightened the shit out of it, I might have to go back and re-torque it to 45 ft-lbs to see if it lessens vibes.

[WetzMS3]

During my hour plus commute in stop and go traffic on the way home tonight I decided to play around more to try to replicate/pinpoint it.

I hear it, on occasion, during clutch engagement and letting off the throttle. It is not consistent, even under similar situations. As I played with it, it seemed to happen more when quickly letting off the throttle at higher rev/low gear. I only got it to do it twice during clutch engagement.

It seems like something shifting during quick, high load situations. Or how ever you would say that in engineer speak. It's hard to tell if it's a lateral shift or not. The mount is still very stiff, and I can't notice a different feel when the clunk is heard, so I'm confident that it is not an issue for anything other than possibly longevity, if even that.

I'll be in touch @Farhan@DM tomorrow and we will get your eyes on it tomorrow night.

[Farhan@DM]

Originally Posted by WetzMS3 During my hour plus commute in stop and go traffic on the way home tonight I decided to play around more to try to replicate/pinpoint it. I hear it, on occasion, during clutch engagement and letting off the throttle. It is not consistent, even under similar situations. As I played with it, it seemed to happen more when quickly letting off the throttle at higher rev/low gear. I only got it to do it twice during clutch engagement. It seems like something shifting during quick, high load situations. Or how ever you would say that in engineer speak. It's hard to tell if it's a lateral shift or not. The mount is still very stiff, and I can't notice a different feel when the clunk is heard, so I'm confident that it is not an issue for anything other than possibly longevity, if even that. I'll be in touch @Farhan@DM tomorrow and we will get your eyes on it tomorrow night.

Try on/off throttle mid turn.

Clunk aside, how is it feeling?

[WetzMS3]

Originally Posted by Farhan@DM Try on/off throttle mid turn. Clunk aside, how is it feeling?

Aside from that sound it feels great. Shifts are much cleaner that the Cobb I had. I can feel the motor moves less under heavy acceleration. Downshifts are smoother and crisper.

There are more vibes than the Cobb I am coming from. But that mount was too soft to perform well also. I plan on upping my idle to smooth the vibes out. The difference is mostly noticeable at idle, and very very slightly on pedals while in motion.

I look forward to the next innovation out of Damond Motorsports.

[ear28]

Originally Posted by jharris243 I did the same...threw on another washer in front of the supplied one. No more clunk although there are definitely more vibes now than before. I just tightened the shit out of it, I might have to go back and re-torque it to 45 ft-lbs to see if it lessens vibes.

I also did this. With the same results, increased vibes (not terrible but noticable) but much less than my temp fix (JBR supplied bolt with nut) and no clunk.

I torqued to 40ft-lbs, let the break-in begin.

[mdl3v8]

@Farhan@DM; is this helpful?

This is parking brake on, in gear (1st, then Reverse, then 1st again), releasing the clutch just past the friction point. You can also see movement at start up.

Edit: mention worked, hooray!

[Chuthor]

Mine got thrown on over this weekend down in southern IL. And I got to test it out on the 300 miles or so ride back and on my usual daily commute today. To give a little background I started with a JBR 80 duro, then the Cobb RMM, and now the Damond Motorsports one. I'll give a summary of my experiences with each.

JBR - This one being the first was fantastic over stock, much stiffer, and really let you know what was going on with the engine. Clutch engagement was easier and more predictable, it vibed a ton at first but lessened after break it. It was liveable but at certain RPMs it just vibed to much for too long. The low RPM ones while violent were manageable but there were certain ones in the 2300-3000 rpm ranges that would get annoying especially if you got to cruising at them. Also they were very noticeable on deceleration. After about a year of that I decided to try out the Cobb one.

Cobb - Very very quiet, little to no vibes at all, a tiny bit at initial take off but almost nothing after that. You'd notice it sometimes when coasting from 3000 down but it was almost nothing. At first it was decently stiff but over time I felt like it softened up to the point where it felt sloppy to me, somewhere between stock and the JBR. You could really feel the engine movement come back when letting off throttle in gear. As comfortable as it was it just wasn't cutting it for harder driving, I had this one in for about a year as well.

Damond Motorsports - I was impressed with this one from the get go while driving a car with the prototype in, I asked if I could preorder one as soon as I was done with a test drive which was on the way to the Epic Nator Meet. It does have vibrations but in a different way, when it does vibe it isn't like teeth/car interior rattling like JBR one, its more like a slight increase in engine feedback to me and it dissipates rather quickly. I can still spot the vibration spots in the 2000-3000 rpm range but again its less a vibration and more of a slight noise increase. I feel extremely connected to the car now and what the clutch and transmission is doing now is almost transparent if that makes sense. The feedback you get from it makes it really easy to drive the car. Definitely no more engine lurching, torque steer seems down (I'm not sure why), and minimal vibes. If it holds up like this I will absolutely be thrilled and be done with the hunt for the RMM that suites me. As you can tell I don't really care about branding, I'll go with whatever works best at a price that is worth its performance and this for me hits all the marks.

TLDR:
JBR - BZZZZZZZzzzzzZZZZZZZzzzz BRRRRRRRRRRRRR
Cobb- flop flop flop flop
Damond Motorsports -

[WetzMS3]

Originally Posted by mdl3v8 @Farhan@DM; is this helpful? This is parking brake on, in gear (1st, then Reverse, then 1st again), releasing the clutch just past the friction point. You can also see movement at start up. Edit: mention worked, hooray!

Sounds like what I've heard.

That video makes me think the clunk is coming from the mount hitting vertical bolt through the sub frame. Is there enough clearance there for it to shift slightly? maybe a super thin, stiff bushing could line that hole to prevent this without adding much movement.

[xfeejayx]

Originally Posted by mdl3v8 @Farhan@DM; is this helpful? This is parking brake on, in gear (1st, then Reverse, then 1st again), releasing the clutch just past the friction point. You can also see movement at start up. Edit: mention worked, hooray!

Are you missing the washer under the head of the bolt, or is it just the angle?

It does help. Thanks.

[mdl3v8]

Originally Posted by xfeejayx Are you missing the washer under the head of the bolt, or is it just the angle? It does help. Thanks.

It's just the angle, both washers are where they were when I opened the box.

[squilliam]

Got mine installed. I'm getting the same clunk as everyone else. I swapped out the supplied washer with my old cpe washer and lock washer, and tried to tighten it to 45lb/ft but couldn't get it tightened all the way to 45lb/ft. Right now it's tightened as much as I could before I busted my hand. Any tips on how to tighten it all the way? I'm using a 3/8 ratchet on the allen key side and a 1/2 torque wrench on the 17mm.

Coming from a Stage 1 CP-E RMM, the vibes are more pronounced from around 1200-2000rpm. After that it's just about the same. Noise is a bit louder as well. Just gotta wait until it breaks in now.

[mdl3v8]

Originally Posted by squilliam Got mine installed. I'm getting the same clunk as everyone else. I swapped out the supplied washer with my old cpe washer and lock washer, and tried to tighten it to 45lb/ft but couldn't get it tightened all the way to 45lb/ft. Right now it's tightened as much as I could before I busted my hand. Any tips on how to tighten it all the way? I'm using a 3/8 ratchet on the allen key side and a 1/2 torque wrench on the 17mm. Coming from a Stage 1 CP-E RMM, the vibes are more pronounced from around 1200-2000rpm. After that it's just about the same. Noise is a bit louder as well. Just gotta wait until it breaks in now.

Carefully

I'm calling this user error more than anything, but unfortunate nonetheless.



Sent from my Samsung GALAXY S III

[grazamataz]

i've taken a couple short drives with it now and the vibes are so much better than i had with the JBR. as was mentioned before, deceleration vibes are nearly gone. a/c vibes are nearly gone. cruising at 2800-3k vibes are nearly gone. downshifting into a turn is a pleasure. i haven't really goosed it yet so i can't say much about that but i'll get there in the next couple days.

there are still some shakes when starting from a stop, but that's good. those vibes help me know good stuff is still going on down there (that's what she said).

i do get the same clunk as everyone else, i've been able to pinpoint it to pretty much two instances. when i'm cruising at 3k-ish RPMs and let off the gas there's a mild clunk, and there's a pretty good ka-chunk on engine start (see attached video). i did add the additional 7/16 washer when i installed the mount and used red threadlock so i know everything is tight.

overall, clunks notwithstanding, i am super happy with this mount already and am looking forward to solving the little issues to make it perfect. also, i busted myself in the eye with the wrench when i was tightening the shoulder bolt and i'm NOT EVEN MAD after driving with this thing in, that's how sweet it is. it's like the tears of a phoenix (harry potter reference, deal with it).

[blam1]

Originally Posted by Farhan@DM For anyone with a clunk, please list what RMM you're coming from if you could.

So mine still clunks with the added lock washer. Clunks on startup, Decel (sounds like two clunks) felt and heard most between 1500-3000 when letting off gas, but more idle vibes than before. I came from JBR 88 RMM, and CPE PMM. I'll get under it tomorrow and re-torque everything to per this thread and see if it fixes anything.

[squilliam]

Originally Posted by mdl3v8 Carefully I'm calling this user error more than anything, but unfortunate nonetheless.

that's exactly what i didn't want to do =/

[Farhan@DM]

Originally Posted by grazamataz i've taken a couple short drives with it... overall, clunks notwithstanding, i am super happy with this mount already and am looking forward to solving the little issues to make it perfect. also, i busted myself in the eye with the wrench when i was tightening the shoulder bolt and i'm NOT EVEN MAD after driving with this thing in, that's how sweet it is. it's like the tears of a phoenix (harry potter reference, deal with it).

Glad you like it. We'll get this clunk taken care of soon.

[blackms3_71]

So is there anyone who has it installed and not getting a clunk?

[dark_matter]

Originally Posted by blackms3_71 So is there anyone who has it installed and not getting a clunk?

I installed mine over the weekend and have since put ~100 miles on it. I did not feel or heard any clunk, but I came from an OE mount with corksport inserts.
My only complain thus far is the vibes at idle. Planning to up the idle to 750rpm go get rid of the idle vibe.

Sent from my Republic Wireless Moto X using Tapatalk

[blackms3_71]

Originally Posted by dark_matter I installed mine over the weekend and have since put ~100 miles on it. I did not feel or heard any clunk, but I came from an OE mount with corksport inserts. My only complain thus far is the vibes at idle. Planning to up the idle to 750rpm go get rid of the idle vibe. Sent from my Republic Wireless Moto X using Tapatalk

Did u torque all bolts down? 75 at frame 45 at engine? Just wondering bc i plan on installing tomorrow

[dark_matter]

70 lb-ft for the OE bolts, as tight as I can get on the shoulder bolt. I did not add an additional washer either.

Sent from my Republic Wireless Moto X using Tapatalk

[blackms3_71]

Originally Posted by dark_matter 70 lb-ft for the OE bolts, as tight as I can get on the shoulder bolt. I did not add an additional washer either. Sent from my Republic Wireless Moto X using Tapatalk

Hmm thats weird that u didnt add the washer as it seems it is bottoming out. And thanks for the input lets hope i dont clunk either

[Etipp98]

Originally Posted by mdl3v8 @Farhan@DM; is this helpful? This is parking brake on, in gear (1st, then Reverse, then 1st again), releasing the clutch just past the friction point. You can also see movement at start up. Edit: mention worked, hooray!

Looks like the mount is contacting the triangular stock brace when it's flexing. Can you see any contact on the mount or the bracket?

[Dimenus]

I haven't noticed any clunk, but I also have a JBR PMM.

Tappin'

[blackms3_71]

Originally Posted by Dimenus I haven't noticed any clunk, but I also have a JBR PMM. Tappin'

Hmm thats. Good point. So guys that are clunking are u still on stock pmm? I mean it shouldnt matter but just trying to get different info to help with this as much as possible

[nindoja]

Originally Posted by blackms3_71 Hmm thats. Good point. So guys that are clunking are u still on stock pmm? I mean it shouldnt matter but just trying to get different info to help with this as much as possible

@JgamB; is on stock PMM and TMM and has no clunking. I don't notice any clunking, but I'm on aftermarket PMM and TMM at this point.

As I recall, we didn't have any issues with the bolt at all. We also didn't use any extra washers on either of our installs.

[himurax13]

Originally Posted by mdl3v8 Carefully I'm calling this user error more than anything, but unfortunate nonetheless. Sent from my Samsung GALAXY S III

Mine is almost that bad but it was incredibly difficult to get to 45 lbs. Even after I tightented it down, I was able to spin the shoulder bolt after everything else was tightened down.

Why couldn't we just have a standard bolt instead of the hex head bolt?

[morbiddk]

Stock PMM. I was clunking before the 7/16 washer supplement to the provided hardware. That said I did have to reseat the 7/16b washer 3 times before everything went together cleanly. Had to be very slow and careful when tightening the nut or it would go crooked and dig in like the supplied washer alone.

I'll put up more of a review tonight.

[blackms3_71]

Originally Posted by nindoja @JgamB; is on stock PMM and TMM and has no clunking. I don't notice any clunking, but I'm on aftermarket PMM and TMM at this point. As I recall, we didn't have any issues with the bolt at all. We also didn't use any extra washers on either of our installs.

Hmm i wonder why some bottom out and some it works fine?!? I myself will be adding a lock washer on the bolt side and i also replaced the washer on the head side with a slightly thicker one so i hope that works and i plan on hitting the 45 ft or maybe even 50ft.


I wondering if some rmm have different washer or nuts vs others. This sucks i was so happy to get this mount and bam clunk issue. We will figure this shit out

[Nano91]

Alright guys and @Farhan@DM; so I went ahead and added 2 washer definitely lost the clunk sound which I believe is due to the fact that the washer on the nut side was topping out, so I went with 2 x 12mm washers thicker than the ones provided, at the moment of tightening everything definitely got tight, not topping out.

Now here are the pictures of the ones I bought went with the small ones


I recorded a video the first start up is with the provided bolts notice how it moves alot, once I put on the washers everything is stiffer, there are some vibration (more tolerable than before) I believe these will go down with some time the clunk is gone as well

YouTube Short

YouTube Short

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk